Even though the recent FAQ update was small, the impact it has on Daemons for list-building is substantial. No longer must you worry about being able to handle six flyers or more. That opens up so much space in a competitive list.
Here's stuff you don't need to even consider anymore:
Fortifications with quad guns/icarus lascannons
Hydras
Officers of the Fleet, and therefore a CCS
My most competitive list used all of these, but I don't need any of them anymore because I can just dodge my opponent if he brings a jillion flyers. I don't care how many come on at once. I can just deny them shots. You may still want a fortification for a Comms Relay, and the Aegis with Comms Relay is probably the best choice now to be quite honest, but I wouldn't take a fortification at all. This frees up tons of points for things like Daemon Princes or Manticores.
In fact, there isn't a whole hell of a lot of need or use for anything IG anymore besides a Vendetta. That means lots more points for Daemons.
Here's what I'm thinking at the tournament standard level of 1850:
Fateweaver
5 Flamers
5 Flamers
6 Flamers
5 Daemonettes
5 Plaguebearers
5 Plaguebearers
5 Screamers
6 Screamers
6 Screamers
Daemon Prince, MOT, BOT, Breath, Wings
Primaris Psyker
Veteran Squad, Bolt Pistol (Rides in de plane.)
Vendetta
1848
There's a whole bunch of valid ways to expand this to 2000. I would add one Plaguebearer to this list and take it to Stones River (1863 point limit) were I not leaving the country next week (dammit...).
Between the two FMCs, and the Vendetta, you can handle the flyer list that poses the greatest threat to you at the moment, which is, of course, Triple Heldrake. Send Bolts of Tzeentch up dey' ass.
It's too bad this will completely change in a couple weeks, but at least things are staying interesting.
Maybe I missed this, but why don't we need to worry about 6+ flyers?
ReplyDeletehttp://daemons40k.blogspot.com/2013/02/the-new-flyer-faqs-just-solved-necron.html
DeleteAnonymous is correct. They can't shoot you anymore. At least, as long as you can deep strike near their board edge and squat in the board center.
Ah. Your diagram is a bit off, I think. Its next to impossible to totally avoid enemy flyers in my experience, but I've found that if you're up against the enemy board edge, you can minimize the number of flyers that can shoot to a manageable level.
DeleteThe problem is that there's nothing that says they have to fly straight on, so my opponents have to come in on some pretty extreme angles. Unless you've got enough units to totally block an opponent's board edge, there's almost always going to be someplace that a flyer or two can move on nearly perpendicular to the board edge and get some shots off.
The corners, in particular, are by no means safe zones, because you can just fly in from the opposite corner. By my calculations, you need to occupy a space approximately 34" wide, along the center of your enemy's deployment zone and within 5" of his board edge, in order to force your opponent to overfly you.
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DeleteOn second thought, your diagram might work, but you'd have to stretch models out along nearly the entirety of the yellow oval facing your opponent's table edge. Tough to do, unless you're running 27 screamers or the like (in which case, I don't think you're worrying too much about flyers).
DeleteThe diagram is imperfect to be sure because I spent 5 minutes on it. The blog is free. But you grasp the principle. Crowd the enemy board edge early to force a flyover, then adjust as necessary. Due to the massive base size of flyers, you don't have to occupy as much space as it seems. With Screamers boosting around it is quite doable. You won't totally eliminate flyer shooting, but you'll greatly minimize it such that it is much less of a concern now than it was a week ago.
DeleteI think it's because flyers can no longer deepstrike or outflank. Making them less desirable to take that many. We'll see if the meta changes.
ReplyDelete